How to get a DAZ|Studio scene into Carrara. Skin effects

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VitalBodies
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Post by VitalBodies » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:35 am

Very nice start, you would laugh if you saw mine so far.
Helps to know what you are doing!

I have no idea what I am doing wrong.
I played with the shaders. It is not hard at all. Lot of surface settings are lost during the export/import from Studio, about the same that Studio.
Is that your shaders or the shader I mentioned?
Any hints or suggestions?

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Post by Lakys » Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:09 am

VitalBodies wrote:Very nice start, you would laugh if you saw mine so far.
Helps to know what you are doing!
Well, I did not manage some of the sss settings, but the shader preview helps much to get a suitable effect.
I have no idea what I am doing wrong.
I don't know neither. :wink:
I played with the shaders. It is not hard at all. Lot of surface settings are lost during the export/import from Studio, about the same that Studio.
Is that your shaders or the shader I mentioned?
Yes I modified a shader from a scene imported from DAZ|Studio.
Any hints or suggestions?
Sure:
Set the shininess to 0
Keep the highlight to the bluish color you got from USMP, but reduce the brightness to 10%. It is annoying as there is no specular strength, so it needs to be included in the highlight color.
For SSS, I tried some rather random settings. Specular color could be a red, you can use diffusion, translucency, fresnel but those values need to remain low otherwise it would become too much bright.
Still, the shader preview helps much for that.

Once you are done with the skin_face you can open other shader, drag and drop settings in order to duplicate them (which is worth for lips, nostril, etc...). I wish I could save the settings and export them, but I have not found yet how to do it.

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This can't right?

Post by VitalBodies » Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:56 pm

I think I am struggling with something fundamental like the program did not load quite right. I might reload it.

My simple scene: V4.2, 4 spot lights, 5 cameras and hair.
Since I did all the ground work in DS it should be easy to recreate it in C6. There are no props, there is no environment, it should be easy. Right?
V4 is in the default pose...

If I take the scene from Daz and load into Carrara, V4 is glowing glossy white in Carrara. This can't be right can it?
My scene in DS: http://www.vitalbodies.com/ws07/images/ ... torial.jpg

My actual goal in C6 is to load V4.2 set up 4 lights and 5 cameras (like I did in DS) and learn how to make V4 more photo realistic.
Then proceed from there...

Unless Carrara is updated (with PowerPose) DS might still be the posing software of choice so I might be going back and forth and thought it would be handy to have the same basic scene in both programs. Plus I wanted to compare the rendering quality between the two programs.

All in all, I think some of my questions have been about some basic things because when I have done what should be really basic (FILE > OPEN) I am getting really weird results.
Attachments
assembly_room.jpg
Is this what you all see? Anyone willing to upload a screen capture?

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Re: This can't right?

Post by Lakys » Fri Feb 22, 2008 8:07 pm

VitalBodies wrote:If I take the scene from Daz and load into Carrara, V4 is glowing glossy white in Carrara.
yes that's right if you read what I explained above. Carrara, just like Bryce doesn't import specular strength. So to not make it that bright, the specular color brightness needs to be reduced to the level of the specular strength.
My actual goal in C6 is to load V4.2 set up 4 lights and 5 cameras (like I did in DS) and learn how to make V4 more photo realistic.
Then proceed from there...
I think you should also try the indirect lighting which offers AO or better. I don't think there is really some need for more than a couple of lights.
Unless Carrara is updated DS might still be the posing software of choice so I might be going back and forth and thought it would be handy to have the same basic scene in both programs. Plus I wanted to compare the rendering quality between the two programs.
I understand what you are trying to do. But you try to compare things which can be hardly compared as they have different purposes, approaches and ways to work.
Carrara render engine looks great. But the shaders look limited (but powerful).
Studio benefits of a Renderman compliant renderer, offering almost the best of the state of art in the CG industry. But its capability is limited to the shader implementations.
All in all, I think some of my questions have been about some basic things because when I have done what should be really basic (FILE > OPEN) I am getting really weird results.
Ah... that's why I use DAZ|Studio. In Studio all makes sense to me, where I need to think in Carrara. :roll:

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Post by Lakys » Fri Feb 22, 2008 8:17 pm

Here is my screenshot. I have not found the window with the interactive OpenGl settings. How do you open it?
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carrara01.jpg
carrara01.jpg (100.06 KiB) Viewed 1056 times

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Post by VitalBodies » Fri Feb 22, 2008 8:50 pm

Thanks for posting that!

My screen looks a bit different see image below.
There is an arrow in a circle on mine.
Scan thru 61 -63 of the manual.
HELP > CARRARA HELP

Then again, your in Express.
Look up Interactive render...

"To open the Interactive Renderer Settings dialog, click the first button that appears in the 3D preview window." The circle with the arrow in it.

On my computer you would see the preview window in the material room.
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assembly_room_0.jpg
assembly_room_0.jpg (8.63 KiB) Viewed 1044 times

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Shaders...

Post by VitalBodies » Fri Feb 22, 2008 9:16 pm

Notice your shaders vs mine.
See all that blue?
I have not done your suggestions yet (shininess to 0 etc) but am working on it.

:shock: I have not ruled out insanity as what I am up against but I am seeing some differences in the screen capture...
Attachments
shaders.jpg
See all that blue...
shaders.jpg (52.56 KiB) Viewed 616 times

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Zero Shininess?

Post by VitalBodies » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:57 pm

Zero Shininess? Here is zero on shininess.

Am I insane or should I reload? See image for face and torso...

I do not have the Brightness slider for highlight. I figured something fundamental must be wrong...
Sure:
Set the shininess to 0
Keep the highlight to the bluish color you got from USMP, but reduce the brightness to 10%. It is annoying as there is no specular strength, so it needs to be included in the highlight color.
For SSS, I tried some rather random settings. Specular color could be a red, you can use diffusion, translucency, fresnel but those values need to remain low otherwise it would become too much bright.
Still, the shader preview helps much for that.

Once you are done with the skin_face you can open other shader, drag and drop settings in order to duplicate them (which is worth for lips, nostril, etc...). I wish I could save the settings and export them, but I have not found yet how to do it.
Attachments
V42_Face Camera_0_shininess.jpg
V42_Face Camera_0_shininess.jpg (22.2 KiB) Viewed 1005 times
Last edited by VitalBodies on Sat Feb 23, 2008 12:48 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by Lakys » Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:16 pm

VitalBodies wrote:Zero Shininess? Here is zero on shininess. Am I insane or should I reload? See image for face and torso...
I do not have the Brightness slider for highlight. I figured something fundamental must be wrong...
Sure:
Set the shininess to 0
Keep the highlight to the bluish color you got from USMP, but reduce the brightness to 10%. It is annoying as there is no specular strength, so it needs to be included in the highlight color.
For SSS, I tried some rather random settings. Specular color could be a red, you can use diffusion, translucency, fresnel but those values need to remain low otherwise it would become too much bright.
Still, the shader preview helps much for that.

Once you are done with the skin_face you can open other shader, drag and drop settings in order to duplicate them (which is worth for lips, nostril, etc...). I wish I could save the settings and export them, but I have not found yet how to do it.
Well if you use only half of what I wrote it for sure won't work.

Please, may you edit the image above to a smaller format? It seems that as it was particularly well optimized (bellow 90K) the system has not resized it. :(

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Highlight color for the skin shader

Post by Lakys » Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:22 pm

That's how it works to get a subtle highlight, shininess is set to 0
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carrara02.jpg

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Subsurface scattering shader settings

Post by Lakys » Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:25 pm

SSS...
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carrara03.jpg
carrara03.jpg (93.17 KiB) Viewed 1022 times

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Can you see why I was struggling?

Post by VitalBodies » Sat Feb 23, 2008 3:25 am

Alright, I can see why this might be driving you all crazy.

:idea: I am all ready there...
My best guess: EXTRA germanium in the brain stem altering my dopamine levels somehow. Most likely the Ventral tegmentum and the Nigrostriatal pathway. The fact that these two are not directly related might indicate the problem is actually elsewhere... Where is the question. Any neurologists out there? I would guess either the Autonomic Nervous System or the Pineal gland itself...

Since I was not quite sure yet and the Cats Claw and Corn Silk had not fully pulled the germanium out of my brain stem...
EDIT: Turns out to be extra (to much) Indium in the Midbrain about level with the optic nerves, Pineal and Pituitary effecting the Ventral tegmentum and the Nigrostriatal pathways via the Pituitary... Well, I was some what close on my guess! :D

I did a reinstall and choose REPAIR.

:shock: Wow, what a difference. :shock:

The Before:
http://www.vitalbodies.com/ws07/images/ ... y_room.jpg

Want to see the after?
http://www.vitalbodies.com/ws07/images/ ... _after.jpg

Apparently everything was so messed up I lost all my cameras except the face camera. :(

Again, thank you for your help and efforts...
They have, do and did make a difference!
Can you see why I was struggling?
Did you find the interactive renderer?
Last edited by VitalBodies on Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Back in the saddle...

Post by VitalBodies » Sat Feb 23, 2008 5:07 am

Ok, here is a rendering done with a whopping 12% shininess!

With all four lights set to ray trace.
I did not turn on soft shadows as this in not a final render, just a test.

Ok the bump is to high and I have to figure out how to add an amplitude slider...

And the hair looks dorky.

Don't laugh this about learning...
:lol: Or do laugh and have fun!
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V42_Face Camera_0_ray_sss.jpg
SSS and 12% shininess...

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Post by Lakys » Sat Feb 23, 2008 5:22 am

VitalBodies wrote:I did a reinstall and choose REPAIR.

:shock: Wow, what a difference. :shock:
:shock:

I can get similar weird effects in my preview using 2000% intensity distant lights. :lol:
But your render has nothing wrong but a too bright highlight color, causing this.
Again, thank you for your help and efforts...
They have, do and did make a difference!
You're welcome. :)
Can you see why I was struggling?
I think yes.
Did you find the interactive renderer?
Yes a useful panel, well hidden. I can see the highlights much better now. :o

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Re: Back in the saddle...

Post by Lakys » Sat Feb 23, 2008 5:30 am

VitalBodies wrote:Ok, here is a rendering done with a whopping 12% shininess!

With all four lights set to ray trace. !
Well except on the breast, I can hardly see the specular/highlights. There might be something wrong with the highlight color you used in some shaders, or is the lighting that soft?
And the SSS you used a brown for the color or something different? I cannot see it.

It seems to me that you will need to look again into the shaders to find out what is happening. Once again, using shader preview helps much. :wink:

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